This bugs me [Archive]

MAZOOM

08-19-2008, 03:13 AM

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13746_7-10015468-48.html

CX-7: The 2009 CX-7's automatic transmission has been recalibrated for smoother shifts. Customer grumblings about the thirsty, peaky nature of the engine will result in a nonturbo version with better fuel economy arriving for the 2010 model year. Nonturbo though? I bet they're going the way of a naturally aspirated four like the Outlander and RAV4, because either V6 in the CX-7 would not make sense, the CX-9 gets low mileage, and the 3.0L is not a MPG star compared to the DISI(even less so thanks to the more aggressive Mazda transmission programming and the CX-7's added weight over the Tribute). But if they replace the turbo I4 with a V6, I would not get another CX-7. Tiguan for me. :D

I lieks this

CX-5: Mazda will share the European Ford Kuga underpinnings and combine it with a design based on the Kazamai concept from the 2008 Moscow auto show. The CX-5 will be smaller than the Escape; Mazda wants to avoid cross-shopping with the CX-7. It may arrive for the 2011 model year.

Shaz

08-19-2008, 03:20 AM

MAZDA CX5 FTW

[/URL] [URL="http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-2008-mazda-cx-5-ar15769/picture112115.html"]http://pictures.topspeed.com/IMG/crop/22/dvxv_460x0w.jpg (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/mazda-cx/ke265.html)
The Mazda CX-5 is a compact crossover SUV that will replace the Tribute as the Mazda’s smallest sport utility vehicle for 2008. Mazda will be announcing this "officially" in January 2008 but the official debut of the new Mazda Tribute is at the New York auto show in April.

Mazda announced that it would not build 2007 model-year Tributes, so will be a full out replacement. It will remain a rebadged Ford (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-2008-mazda-cx-5-ar15769.html#) Escape, and will be assembled in Claycomo,MIso (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/iso/index47.html)urri along with the Escape and Mercury Mariner. Competitors are the Honda Element, Toyota Rav4 and Hyundai Tucson, along with other small SUVs (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-2008-mazda-cx-5-ar15769.html#).
The cx-5 will probably distance itself a bit from the design cues of the Ford Escape and Mercury Mariner this time around, although the drivetrain will most likely be the same.
The interior is also similar, and will be upgraded with higher materials and better features. Mazda CX-5 will ride under the same chassis (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-2008-mazda-cx-5-ar15769.html#) as the 2008 Escape, but with some upgrades, will have better driving performance. Mazda will take some cues from the Cx-7, on CX-5 body.
The Japanese automobile (http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-2008-mazda-cx-5-ar15769.html#) maker should really have a full lineup in the next couple of years, giving Mazda the strongest niche lineup in the continental US.

MAZOOM

08-19-2008, 03:27 AM

I know it won't look like that, because if it did, no thanks.

But it's comforting to hear it will ride on the Kuga's platform.

Crash

08-19-2008, 08:36 AM

You have to learn how to drive the CX7 to avoid turbo. If you do that, mileage is fine (fun factor does go down though).

I think there is room for the 4 cyl and the turbo - with vastly improved mileage. Largely, recalibrate so that the turbo kicks in when the RPM's jump up...if they sustain at 2.5K (which is about 120km's per hour) - the turbo doesn't need to run. A turbo is meant for immediate thrust - not sustaining.

I really don't agree with the tranny comments; I honestly think that the CX7 is one of the better (if not best) tranny's on the market. I'm always shocked at how smooth it is.

Yes, there are room for improvements within our beloved little SUV. However I don't think they need to include a 6 cyl.

leshii

08-19-2008, 10:19 AM

^^^ what he said. I think non-turbo I4 is silly on the 7. The 7 is too heavy for an I4 to provide decent performance, and V6 is big and heavy which will make the 7 bigger and heavier (look under the hood, any extra room there? :) )

IMO turbo I4 is perfect, because you can drive it most of the time w/o turbo kicking in and save $$$ on gas, and then have fun with turbo and pay a little bit extra for it. Makes perfect sense to me. I agree though that they should put on a bigger turbo that will spool about 800-1000 RPM later and hold boost all the way to the red line.

mikomi

08-19-2008, 10:25 AM

Sounds like a smart move. It's about time Mazda had their own small SUV/CUV/Glorified Hatchback.

astraelraen

08-19-2008, 11:49 AM

Its gotta be a V6, there's no way the 2.5l 170hp 4 cylinder could even begin to move the CX7. The 3.7l V6 already gets roughly the same MPG as the 2.3 turbo, I bet they just adjust the shift patterns or something to get higher EPA.

4000lb + 170hp = fail.

leshii

08-19-2008, 11:52 AM

4000 + 170hp = no zoom-zoom. lol.
It will rev high and be underpowered.

MAZOOM

08-19-2008, 11:58 AM

If it was it would probably be FWD only(3,7xx) and lighter thanks to the lack of all of the turbo plumbing. Like the MAZDA5 (slow as hell). The Outlander with the 4cyl and 4WD comes in at 35ish thousand pounds and is about 100lbs lighter than it's V6 counterpart.

"non turbo version" makes it sound like a naturally aspirated DISI or just the regular 2.5L, they are moving to DISI on all engines.

Leeep

08-19-2008, 01:11 PM

What if they went with a normaly aspirated I4 in the Mazda CX-7 and a Mazdaspeed CX-7 with the turbo DISI.
THink about it, this would allow for a more focused Speed CX-7. 20" wheels lower suspension, the higher output of the speed 3, manual tranny, etc. and they could market the regular mazda cx-7 as the starter family wagon.
I always see soccer-mom types driving CX-7's and have to wonder if they even appreciate all the HP and technology under their hood or if they just bought it because it looks younger and cooler than a RAV4.

08-19-2008, 01:17 PM

Six cyclinder doesn't interest me at all would like to see later spooling larger turbo be just right to me then, tranny is fine like it as is, get good mileage if u drive with light foot but fun factor is there if u need it or want play a little

leshii

08-19-2008, 01:35 PM

About soccer moms, I must say that I don't see 7s here very often, and almost never women driving them. Then again, I can see its appeal to that category of folks.

But hey, if you're willing to put a few grand into the car, you can make it look and drive quite a bit better than stock (as nice as the car is initially).

IMO that's the way to go - personalize the car according to what matters to you the most and how much of that "what" you want. This car has an impressive modding potential and aftermarket part availability. Not only does it rival any SUV, but also a significant number of cars.

astraelraen

08-19-2008, 01:53 PM

You guys are crazy if you think an auto tranny CX7 would be "fun" to drive with a turbo that spools 3000rpm or later. The CX7 is a boat, it needs power early and looses way too much power through the A/T.

I love getting spanked off the line by 4 cylinder sedans. My wife's N/A 175hp/tq Legacy will smoke the CX7 off the line, its got such a broad torque curve.

leshii

08-19-2008, 02:01 PM

^^ For the 7 I think that's in big part because of TMIC and Mazda's throttle position management. I'm guessing that 7 should be able to post low 6 second 0-to-60mph times with some basic mods (breathing in/out, cooling and engine management). Someone really needs to find a way to firm up shifts on the slushbox though.

Leeep

08-19-2008, 02:02 PM

as good as this auto is, it can't read your mind.
I love a manual tranny on a turbo.
THe best feeling in the world, holding a lower ratio through a turn to keep the turbo spooled up and rolling on the throttle at the exit.

leshii

08-19-2008, 02:05 PM

THe best feeling in the world, holding a lower ratio through a turn to keep the turbo spooled up and rolling on the throttle at the exit.

For that here is the manual mode ;)

MachZ

08-19-2008, 02:58 PM

Smooth shifting is a joke for sports vehicles in my opinion... smooth is nice, but speed is better. The CX-7's auto tranny just about takes all of the fun away in my opinion. I've actually found the shifting to be worse in manual mode, there's what seems to be a longer delay between shifting (mostly because of the time it takes between when you move the gear lever and the shift actually completes).

MAZOOM

08-19-2008, 08:00 PM

I wish they would add in an S mode and keep the D mode for the "smoother shifts"

It works in the A4, D is such a gas saving drag and it has that annoying CVT pull, but the S mode really livens up with the fabricated shift points(CVT).

This bugs me because it sounds like MAZDA trying to be all things to all people again, and they don't do it well because I don't want a V6 in the CX-7.

leshii

08-19-2008, 08:12 PM

Realistically though, I can see why they would be having a hard time making such decisions for the 7. It's just the type of the car itself that makes it very difficult for them. It's very very difficult to market what many will consider as a glorified sleek minivan as a performance car and you will never sell it if the transmission is to firm, the _SUV_ is too low to the ground, the engine noise is excessive in the cabin or it has a manual tranny. I think Mazda is just trying to cover all the bases at least to some degree, which means that nothing is perfect or excellent, but almost everything is good or decent. I just hope that aftermarket part companies see the potential of this car (like AutoExe and CP-E) and let those interested to transform their car into something that will be able to participate in a track day once in a while.

MAZOOM

08-19-2008, 08:18 PM

It sold above expectations for 2007, with 42K units, so they're doing something right. Going with a me-too V6 is not the best way to be a niche car manufacture. The CX-7 is a bit higher off the ground than most other CUV's, too. I know they're some manufactures that program in a delay, or slow things down to reduce shock to the transmission. The MAZDA5 has a manual, it's portly, slow, only seats 6 people and I see them all around in Maricopa, and even in las vegas. Which is why I believe they're going to drop the price and put the new 2.5L in(possibly with DISI for a power and FE increase), I went back and watched all of the videos they had for the press release and they specifically stated they went with a 4cyl because they could slope the hood, and seat the engine further back in the engine bay(styling, handling).

leshii

08-19-2008, 08:26 PM

I think soooo tranny many complaints would go away if our friends at CP-E can devise a flash that will firm up shifts in manual mode.

Monotonous ONE

08-25-2008, 03:22 AM

yea

and while CP-E is at it...maybe they could make my CX7 fly so that i can avoid traffic lights

GTCX-7

09-10-2008, 03:09 AM

They need to put a 20B turbo rotary engine.:D

Back to reality I think Mazda is going to find out very fast when they install that N/A engine and find that the MPG are going to be about the same or worst.4000 LBS + 170 HP = more RPM's to move Car More RPM's more gas.even if they take away 100-200LBS from not having the turbo.

glyphon

09-10-2008, 09:19 AM

i'd trade in for a CX-7r :D

as for an N/A version, i think it could potentially get bumped up a few mpg. for the sport version, dropping 200lbs would take it down to 3500lbs. that weight puts it close to the CR-V (just a little more actually), but if it is in the 170-175hp range like people are thinking, that'd give it just a little more power than the CR-V, to pull the little extra weight around. And the CR-V has been rated at 20/27.

so, a ~3mpg increase seems to be realistic and achievable.

shadow1

09-10-2008, 05:48 PM

Keep in mind that the NA version of the DISI motor will be 100+ lbs lighter (no turbo, IC, turbo plumbing). Also I would totally expect better mpg in direct proportion to slower acceleration. Speed costs gas.

MachZ

09-10-2008, 06:56 PM

Speed costs gas.

Ehh... not always. If done right, vehicles that make more power can still retain good fuel economy. I personally know a guy that is making nearly 500 whp in an 80's 300ZX and still got 30 mpg on a highway trip to a Z fest, which is better than stock. Generally factory vehicles will be the opposite though due to various reasons (mostly emissions from what I've seen).

Monotonous ONE

09-11-2008, 01:10 AM

if people want an NA four banger then they should get the Tribute

do they even make those peices of garbage any more????

CX-7s are for SPORT

glyphon

09-11-2008, 01:42 AM

do they even make those peices of garbage any more????

Yes, the Mazda Explorer is still made. although, i think i read some where that it was going to be phased out in the next couple of years. it is rumored to be replaced by a Mazda variant of the Ford Kuga, which is being released in Europe in the 2009 MY. The replacement is rumored to be called the CX-5.

2009 Ford Kuga
http://www.mcx7.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1228&stc=1&d=1221108099

shadow1

09-11-2008, 08:18 AM

Let this go guys. If you look at every vehicle on the road where there is a low power and high power engine option (eg, 4 cylinder vs 6 cylinder), the low power motor outsells the high power motor by at least 3 to 1. Same will happen here. This is purely a dollars and sense move by Mazda to lower the price of the CX7 and sell more cars. Personally I would rather keep the reputation of the CX7 for performance intact but what can you do?

MAZOOM

09-11-2008, 05:19 PM

Most outlander buyers are still opting for the V6, and the RAV4 has a big chunk of sales that are the V6.

Still sounds like they're trying to be all things to all people again, like in the 90's, see how that turned out.

Rick's CX-7

09-11-2008, 06:04 PM

Why not make the DISI an option? In small quantities, it shouldn't cost Mazda all that much.

MAZOOM

09-11-2008, 06:18 PM

Why not make the DISI an option? In small quantities, it shouldn't cost Mazda all that much.
I can't say for certain they will, but they will offer the DISI as an option I'm sure... the new DISI turbocharged engines are coming in 2011.

shadow1

09-11-2008, 06:41 PM

Why not make the DISI an option? In small quantities, it shouldn't cost Mazda all that much.

Do you mean a naturally aspirated DISI motor?

Rick's CX-7

09-11-2008, 06:45 PM

Well, either that or a conventional N/A 4-banger and leave the turbo DISI as an option.
A turbo DISI 2.5L would be hot....the way it should have been since day one!

MAZOOM

09-11-2008, 07:40 PM

Do you mean a naturally aspirated DISI motor?
They will have those by 2015.

GTCX-7

09-11-2008, 09:25 PM

CX-7r sounds good and about 400 HP who cares then about MPG.:D
But They need minimum of 200 HP with a N/A motor to make it some way fun.

Leeep

09-12-2008, 12:59 PM

ottoblotto

09-13-2008, 12:26 AM

I'll say it again.
A NA four or six as standard for the Mazda CX-7. Add a Mazdaspeed CX-7 with the turbo DISI, manual tranny, maybe lowered an inch or so.
With a manual, they could probably bump the power up to speed 6 levels with less concern over lag.
It would allow them to focus the Speed CX-7 (Speed 7?) more towards all out sports car without having to worry about losing the young family/soccer mom demographic.

i like that alot. sounds sensible. but of course i cant see the BIG picture. how much money would go into r&r/production of a speed7 (i like how that sounds) vs the actual amount of people that would be interested in something like that? seems like the speed line is more towards the early twenties group. hm, actually thats pretty good. you could market it as the family sports crossover... show a mom/dad taking kids to school all smiles everyone comfy in the back, then after the kids get out, turning the music up, and hitting the windy backroads and having a blast. speed7, break the routine and the sound barrier... lol!

Monotonous ONE

09-13-2008, 02:27 AM

if they did a mazdaspeed 7 i wouldnt be able to afford it

which would be gay

shadow1

09-13-2008, 09:46 AM

From day one I jokingly referred to my CX7 as a Mazdaspeed 7.

Whatever

11-04-2008, 11:16 AM

shadow1

11-10-2008, 07:45 PM

I doubt there is much of a market for a Mazda branded 340hp SUV. That would push the cost well into the 40k range and compete against Acura and Infiniti. Not gonna happen.

MAZOOM

11-10-2008, 07:46 PM

I've heard rumors that the CX-9 will be getting the Ford EcoBoost 3.5L V6 TT engine soon that is supposed to be capable of getting 20+ MPG's in a full size pickup truck. It is supposed to churn out 340HP and 3xxTQ. If you want a Mazdaspeed 7 then that is the engine you want because it will easily be capable of 400+ HP.
The ecoboost engine is a $700 upgrade on the Ford stuff. It all depends on if Mazda want's to use it, they'd have to build it in Japan(like they do now with the 3.7L MZI). Still, it'd be nose heavy.